Transcript
Grace Ann Chua [00:04]: In today’s episode, we have the team from Volunteer Guitar Connection, a groundup group to speak with us on their experience with leadership succession. Welcome to Crafting Communities, your companion in your journey to shape a better experience for the community that you care about. I’m your host, Grace. Today, I have Yi Qi and Jeremy to share with us more about the inner workings of their volunteer musicians!
Grace Ann Chua [00:34]: Hi Yi Qi and Jeremy, welcome to today’s episode of Crafting Communities.
Yi Qi Ng [00:38]: Hello.
Jeremy Kosman [00:39]: Hi!
Grace Ann Chua [00:40]: Thanks so much for being here with us today. So, to begin, could you share a bit about Volunteer Guitar Connection?
Yi Qi Ng [00:45]: Volunteer Guitar Connection or VGC in short, is an informal volunteer group. And we started in I think, 2004. Back then, it was kind of a different world from today, I suppose. And the volunteers who founded it, were actually volunteering in elderly homes. And they were regular volunteers and they realized that, when you walk into an elderly home, all you hear is basically silence or you hear the fan on the wall. I think music is something that is very rare in those days. Back then, we didn’t have like Spotify or probably karaoke systems. We were not like that savvy as well, right? So, the founders of the group really wanted to see how to bring live music into elderly homes. And that was when they started playing the guitar.
Yi Qi Ng [01:38]: So, a couple of them just started playing the guitar for one another in the homes performing for the elderly. And more and more volunteers came on board because they said, “Hey, you know, that sounds fun. That’s something that we can bring to more homes.” So, that’s where the movement spread. And I think what’s magical about that was that it was really informal and ground up. And after a couple of years, they realized that it is something that not just the elderly sector needs. Even in other VWOs, say, in children’s homes, this is where music is largely non-existent, because you may not have volunteers coming in to teach children how to play music or sing, and all that. And that is where I think the vision of VGC really came to life, where the founders and volunteers really wanted to see how we could ensure that nobody is deprived of music, regardless of their background and circumstances.
Grace Ann Chua [02:30]: That’s very cool. Is everyone in VGC a guitarist? Do you have to be a guitarist to join VGC?
Yi Qi Ng [02:39]: We do have an entry criteria. And now I think it is musician, maybe Jeremy can talk a bit more about that?
Jeremy Kosman [02:46]: Yes, not necessarily guitar. We have a couple of volunteers, she played ukulele as well and even the keyboard. I mean, a number of volunteers also mentioned like, “Why is it Volunteer Guitar Connection? Why don’t we change it to Volunteer Music Connection?” I mean, that’s a good point. Because we really focus on, you know, using music as a tool for bringing happiness. So, although our name is Volunteer Guitar Connection and we teach guitar to volunteers predominantly, we do welcome everyone who are able to contribute through music, be it using any instrument or ukulele. Even Chinese traditional instruments, there are some who actually played the Guzheng or Erhu. So, there’s no boundaries to that, to using music.
Grace Ann Chua [03:29]: And what are your roles, Yi Qi and Jeremy?
Yi Qi Ng [03:32]: I’ll start first because mine is more for history than Jeremy’s. I joined VGC in 2009. So, that’s more than a decade ago. And I was with I think most of the pioneer volunteers who kind of set up some of the processes as well as the things that we wanted VGC to be like. Yeah, I was the chairperson of the group for a couple of years. That was back then in 2010 to 2015 or so. And that was also when we started some of the elections and the leadership succession planning. I’m very happy that Jeremy joined us later on. But was it 2017? Yeah. And that was when he also took over leadership for one of our very passionate volunteers.
Jeremy Kosman [04:15]: Yep. So, myself, as Yi Qi mentioned, I joined in about I think late 2017 and through 2018, around there. I started as a regular volunteer, I was joining VGCs programs. The main one is to strum and sing and bring joy to the beneficiaries at the nursing homes. So, I’ve been doing that for I think, 2018-2019, and joined a couple of the events, including the charity concert, that’s where I met Yi Qi. I think, towards the end of 2019, I got the opportunity to step up and serve in the committee, and I’ve been serving as the chairperson since then. That’s about two and a half years now.
Grace Ann Chua [04:56]: So, Jeremy is the current chairperson of VGC and Yi Qi was the previous chairperson of VGC many years ago.
Yi Qi Ng [05:03]: Yeah, that’s right.
Grace Ann Chua [05:04]: Yi Qi, why is it important to set up a leadership succession plan?
Yi Qi Ng [05:10]: Back then, when I first stepped up to lead VGC, it was a very informal process. So, it was just the previous chairperson approaching me and asked me, “Hey, would you mind leading the group and helping us chart where we wanted to go and work with the various committee members?” And it was a couple of years that made us realize that actually, that wasn’t quite sustainable. Because in a volunteer group especially, I think we have volunteers from very diverse backgrounds. And that also means that all of us lead very different lives and very different schedules, and obviously, very differing extent of commitment levels. So very often, we will have volunteers who are very passionate to serve, but may not have the time to do so. And also, some volunteers who are very, very good and competent, but not being able to commit to a leadership role.
Yi Qi Ng [06:08]: So, that also got us thinking as to how we should sustain our group because the committee is very essential, I think, in helping us run the operations of the group, ensuring that there’s recruitment going on, the volunteers are coming in, there are trainers to help us run down the programs that we are doing for the VWOs. We also have logistics to take care of when we go for performances, either charity performances or even performing in homes, we need equipment. And all that requires a group of passionate volunteers not just to serve, but also to run the operations on a consistent basis. So, I think that was when we thought we needed to establish some kind of process to develop our volunteers, to develop talent, and also explore how we can develop leadership at all levels. So, it’s not just about the committee and the chairperson or vice chairperson, it was also about how we could bring volunteers in to be leaders and lead various aspects, be it on a formal or informal basis.
Grace Ann Chua [07:13]: You talked about the committee, right? How do you decide what were the roles needed in your committee?
Jeremy Kosman [07:18]: The roles are driven by the programs that we have, and the needs and the situation of the volunteering scene, goes back to our mission of bringing the joy of music, sharing the joy of music to the less privileged. In the past, I think our previous chairperson set up this program called Regular Volunteering Program, I think just really recently, like in 2009, that program essentially helped us to really focus on our mission and deliver it on a more regular basis, rather than on an ad hoc and inconsistent basis. The Regular Volunteering Program is where we essentially just strum and sing ring life music to nursing homes and to the patients at the community hospitals. And that kind of setup its own program and that’s where we need people to run the program, and that’s where have the role of the Regular Volunteering Program IC. So similarly, that’s how it goes for the other programs as well. We will need an events IC because there was a need to occasionally carry out ad hoc stage performances, and because of stage performances, then that’s why we need to have a logistics IC– someone to take care of the equipment. So, it’s really driven by the needs of the community and how we can bring across our mission and serve the less privileged.
Yi Qi Ng [08:32]: Yeah. And just to add, if you think about the vision, if you want nobody to be deprived of the joy of music, and you need people to bring the joy of music to beneficiaries, then those questions form, right? How do you get the volunteers? So, that’s where you need someone to recruit and manage recruitment, and people to publicize the cause. So that’s where you need publicity and someone to be in charge of that. So everything, I think, goes back to how we want to fulfill our mission and how we can get more volunteers on board to help us achieve that.
Grace Ann Chua [09:08]: Thanks Yi Qi and Jeremy. I’m going to shift the conversation now a bit more on to the leadership succession process. How did you decide that elections were the way to go about with establishing the next batch of leaders?
Yi Qi Ng [09:20]: It may not be the best way. It’s something that we explored and has served us well. So, I think this is something to keep in mind. Right? It may not work for everyone. And I guess in many organizations or even societies, when they are established, a lot of groups have something like a process, like the elections, and I suppose for us, it was important because when the group grew, I mean, we used to be like 10-20 volunteers and now I think we’ve grown to quite a sizable number, right? What’s the number? How many do you have now, Jeremy?
Jeremy Kosman [09:53]: More than 200 members, but at any point in time, there’s about 30 active volunteers.
Yi Qi Ng [10:00]: Yeah, I think, at our peak, maybe 2015 or something, it went up to like 400 or 500 at a time. Approaching someone that you know is a good way to get someone to step up. but it didn’t mean that we knew everyone. Like we didn’t know everyone’s interests, everyone’s skills, everyone’s aspirations. And that was where the elections serve as well, because there was a nomination process, where members were invited to nominate someone, they could nominate themselves as well. And that gives us a sense of who’s interested and willing to step up, for one. And more importantly, I think it’s important to kind of create that awareness and desire for volunteers to serve in other ways, right? If they feel that this is something that they want to do.
Grace Ann Chua [10:49]: I think it’s really great that y’all chose elections as the format to go forth with, because I think when people think of elections, it’s something that happens within a school context, like, Student Council nomination, Student Council election. Or, you think like GRC parliamentary elections kind of concept. But I think it’s very cool how as a voluntary group that exists that’s totally run by volunteers that elections is the mode that y’all chose. I also really appreciate what you expressed about how it’s an opportunity for people to step up. If they’re not so involved, they still know that with this election cycle, it’s an opportunity for them to join the committee or get more involved if they would like to.
Yi Qi Ng [11:28]: That’s right. I think the volunteering space is also a challenge. For the first few times we had elections, nobody wanted to join. And I suspect, even today, we might have a similar issue because everyone’s so busy and it is commitment, on top of what you’re already doing for the community. Monday to Friday, you work. Saturday to Sunday, maybe one of the days you spend with your family and the other day maybe you dedicate to volunteering. And if you step up as a volunteer leader, you have to find even more time, carve out time to do that additional bit to help the group move to a better place. So, I will say it’s challenging. And we’re still continually exploring to see how we can expand opportunities for our volunteers to serve, even if it’s not in a formal way, like in a committee. So, I think that’s something important to also consider.
Jeremy Kosman [12:27]: Yeah, I guess that’s where the election and the voting by the community helps, right? Because if let’s say, a group of people voted for you, it can give you a bit of a vote of confidence that people trust you to step up. In a way, you kind of get peer pressure, not really peer pressure. But ultimately, it’s your choice to step out. But in a way, it’s not like we are being handpicked by someone from the top. And it’s not really biased, per se. So, I think without the election, I probably won’t be in the committee, because Yi Qi doesn’t know me at all before the election. And if she wants to handpick people, then she probably won’t handpick me.
Grace Ann Chua [13:11]: She didn’t even know that you existed.
Jeremy Kosman [13:13]: Yeah, probably not.
Yi Qi Ng [13:15]: I would have handpicked you, Jeremy.
Jeremy Kosman [13:18]: Oh, okay. I trust you. Yeah, so I guess it’s a good thing. In a way, it eliminates bias and gives equal opportunity to people across the board, the volunteer groups.
Grace Ann Chua [13:32]: I think the voting process is great because it gives the community ownership. It gives the incoming leadership team a strong mandate and members also make an active decision about who they think would be a good leadership team. How do you make it less intimidating for someone who decides to run for elections?
Yi Qi Ng [13:46]: I think they’re the decision making itself and really considering whether or not you have the time and bandwidth and all that, I think that takes careful consideration and probably some time. If you have a family, maybe you want to talk to your family, right? I mean, obviously I’m not running for MP but that takes up quite a bit of time. Our election is pretty much like a usual election, but probably less formal. So, we would call for nominations. And people have a window to nominate themselves or nominate someone else. And once that window closes, we will write to all the nominees and say, “Hey, you know, you’re nominated. And if you accepted, could you give us a short write up about yourself?” And that just helps us put it out before the day of elections. And on election day, people just turn up. I mean, the last round, we ran it virtually. So, members as well as the nominees turned up and shared a little bit of what they do and why they want to serve. And then the voting was done online.
Grace Ann Chua [14:47]: So quite straightforward. Nothing too fancy, you know, like campaigning?
Yi Qi Ng [14:52]: It’s not really. Yeah.
Jeremy Kosman [14:56]: Also, probably because not a lot of candidates per se are fighting for the spot.
Yi Qi Ng [15:02]: Volunteers serve across the island. Pre-COVID days, we will gather for gatherings and learning from one another. Pretty much across the whole year, across the weekends, we are serving in different locations. So, campaigning is going to be a bit tough, I think.
Jeremy Kosman [15:20]: Yi Qi, you mentioned that you ask the volunteers to submit names. That’s just the start of the process, right? And then based on the number of names that you submitted, then you will kind of be shortlisted. And then you will reach out to the shortlisted candidates and ask, “Hey, you’ve been nominated. Would you like to run for the position? And then if you agree to it, then you do a write up.” And then you tell them whoever has got the largest number of votes, he will be the chairperson, and then the second largest will be the vice chair. So, I think for the receiving side of things, it’s not as taxing as the one running it. Yi Qi is running it. I think she does a lot more of the heavy lifting of running the election process. But the one who’s on the receiving side, like myself, I simply have to provide the write up, and then kind of attend the election day. And yeah, I guess that’s it, like introduce yourself. And then most of the work happens after the election day, that’s when reality sets in.
Grace Ann Chua [16:20]: When you’ve actually stepped up and the handover process has begun. I think interesting, because now we’re talking about the operations of what goes into facilitating that next level of leadership succession. I’m curious, Yi Qi, what do you look for in a potential successor or what were you looking for?
Yi Qi Ng [16:36]: I think, in the earlier days, it was pretty much whoever could help take over. I mean, we were a very small group and you need someone with very high commitment. I think that’s hard especially for adults. But putting that aside, I think, what was very clear to us, and we do have a mentor Siew Weng, he was the founder with a couple of the pioneer volunteers, I think what’s very important for a leader is that he or she clearly understands why VGC exists, why it’s so important that our organization is still around and doing what we do. So earlier on, if we think about what VGC does, just how it looks, it’s really just going about strumming and singing at the different elderly homes. And it’s very easy to kind of expand and do a lot of other things. And I guess the role of the chairperson is to also give people a sense of the importance and their impact. And that’s something I don’t think we can lose sight of, if we want to continue to be around in the next 5 to 10 years.
Grace Ann Chua [17:45]: What was most challenging about finding a successor?
Yi Qi Ng [17:48]: I think what’s most challenging about finding a successor? I think Jeremy can answer this question because he’s looking for a successor…in the next year or so.
Jeremy Kosman [17:58]: It’s a good chance to publicize, right? You can apply right now! I guess what’s most challenging that we see right now is someone who has the willingness to step up, to show the initiative. There are a couple of people who really embodies VGC’s mission and everything, but unfortunately, as Yi Qi mentioned, not all of them are available. They have other commitments or rather they just choose to play a more secondary role, like probably just as a volunteer or support in the back ends. But maybe finding someone who both have the combination of embodying the vision and mission, the spirit of VGC, and also has the capacity and willingness to step up. Probably it will take time to find. And it’s something that we are trying to do mainly by probably involving some volunteers now and then to take up some mini roles, mini projects along the way. And hopefully, we can grow and take on bigger responsibilities. Yi Qi?
Yi Qi Ng [19:07]: If I could reframe that question a bit. I think the larger question here is, how do we create the conditions for a leader to surface? How do you create the conditions for someone who is willing to take on the leadership position to thrive when he or she decides to take the plunge and commit himself or herself to the cause? And that’s why I hesitate a bit because when you talk about creating conditions, it’s not just about the person. And I believe that as long as there’s somebody who is very passionate about the cause, it is our role as mentors or as more senior volunteers to then figure out how we can help that person grow. And that has to happen even before that person steps up as a leader, right?
Yi Qi Ng [19:58]: So once you step in as a volunteer, all of us are leaders in our own right, because we are serving the community in various ways. And the question is then, how do we help communicate and help all our volunteers see that the role of leadership is important, and there are varied ways to serve, right? I think even in everyday acts of volunteerism, when you interact and work with diverse individuals, that takes skill, that’s an art. And it’s not just about the music you play, but also how you work with the rest of your band members, the rest of your volunteers, how you show up. So, it really starts from day one, I suppose, and ensuring that we have the right conditions for all our volunteers to flourish, for our volunteers to understand the meaning of being a VGC volunteer and understanding why we exist. I think that’s really crucial. And that’s the challenge, I think. And if you do that well, we wouldn’t worry about the leader, right? Because whoever steps up, will be well supported by a good team. And whoever steps up can also see the meaning of what he or she does. I think that’s absolutely important.
Grace Ann Chua [21:11]: Yeah. Thanks for sharing that. Jeremy, why did you agree to step up as a new leader of VGC?
Jeremy Kosman [21:17]: Why I agreed to step up is because firstly, VGC’s mission and vision resonated with me. And VGC has really enriched my life, through my volunteering with our beneficiaries and meeting new friends. So, that’s why I feel like it’s an opportunity for me to give back and carry VGC forward as well. And finally, I’m also humbled by the votes and the trust the other volunteers have in me. So, that gave me the confidence to take it up as well.
Grace Ann Chua [21:45]: A lot of people when given an opportunity to step up, in leadership sometimes feel very scared, and they don’t feel that they are ready for what is to come. How did you know that you were ready?
Jeremy Kosman [21:56]: I was also scared. I think feeling scared to step up to something bigger than yourself is natural. Before stepping into the role, I was always interested in leadership, as a personal development as well. So, I guess it’s also an opportunity for me to put my knowledge into practice. So, I was both scared but at the same time, I was excited. I knew that I wanted to do it. So, it’s not something that I dread. So that’s how you kind of know that you want to do it, like you’re excited by the prospect of it.
Grace Ann Chua [22:27]: How did you establish your leadership upon taking over?
Jeremy Kosman [22:30]: Stepping up as the chairperson is kind of a big deal. You’re kind of in charge of everyone now. I think firstly, being voted helps. It goes back to the election system. It goes to show that the vote of confidence that I got from the volunteers gave me an easier time to step into the role. And then I also initiated several activities to bring the team together, things like workshops, to help plan/chart out the direction of the team. So, I guess that’s how I also demonstrated my skills and abilities to kind of establish my credibility a bit, as well. And also, I guess, with leadership, you also must listen to your people. It’s not just like top down ordering, but you must listen to what other people are telling you. So I guess, showing listening skills and showing empathy to teammates is also important.
Grace Ann Chua [23:24]: Yi Qi, how did the mentors and advisors or VGC help Jeremy as a new leader establish his leadership when he stepped up?
Yi Qi Ng [23:33]: I don’t think he needed us to help establish him as a leader. I thought that was quite an interesting question. Do you need to establish your leadership or not? And what do you do when you don’t establish your leadership? What does that look like? And I don’t have a good answer, actually. But I suppose one thing that came to my mind was credibility. I think credibility is not just about people voting you in, right? Because even if you’re voted in and you don’t demonstrate those qualities that people thought you had, it’s not going to work, right? But how I think Jeremy and many, many passionate leaders, many passionate volunteers of VGC stepped up was really to show how we bring diverse people together, right? And being put in the leadership position, I don’t think it just means you call the shots, right? What you say people do?
Yi Qi Ng [24:29]: But it’s really about bringing together all the diverse viewpoints and trying to figure out where do we go from here and what’s our common dream? What is it that we want to do together as a team in two years? And I think that’s something that Jeremy also did very well. I mean, he mentioned things like workshops and bringing the team together. But I think what he didn’t mention was how he listened and also how he reached out to the rest of VGC. So I think that’s really important, when you first step as a leader, you need to figure out where everybody is at, so that you can help everybody move to a better place and somewhere that people actually want to be.
Grace Ann Chua [25:10]: If you could go back in time, would you have done anything differently for leadership succession?
Yi Qi Ng [25:15]: On my part, I think knowledge management is something that’s very important, which I wish I could have improved on in my time. So Jeremy, can say a bit more about that? I think he’s done quite a great job when he took over.
Jeremy Kosman [25:30]: Yeah, sure. So I think when I took over, there was a gap in the processes– not really a gap in the processes, but more of like, the handover, there were some missing knowledge and gaps and information that we have to really dig out. And then that’s where the team kind of decided that, “Hey, I think moving forward, we should maybe document our processes to see ways to improve, find ways to improve the process.” And that’s why we started these guidebooks. And it turns out that the guide books actually help and we intend to use the guide books also for future transfers and handovers. So that’s where we came about the guidebooks because we had to do a lot of digging when we took over the team and understanding, and things like that.
Grace Ann Chua [26:11]: Are these guidebooks now like a Google Doc?
Jeremy Kosman [26:15]: Yeah. A humble Google Doc that will keep getting updated along the way as things change, especially now with COVID-19, the different processes here and there. So it’s an evolving document that will keep changing.
Grace Ann Chua [26:29]: Google Doc is a good tool since it’s a collaborative this thing that the next generations of VGC leaders can keep updating.
Jeremy Kosman [26:37]: Yeah. And it’s free.
Yi Qi Ng [26:39]: Going back to your question, Grace, I think there is something else that I might do differently. And I guess in the early days, we were very focused on really running the operations. And a lot of the time spent in committee meetings we were discussing work basically. And after like a decade or so in the group, I was reflecting on my experience, and I realized that the things that I learned and what I took away most with me were the people, like the relationships. And that’s why I also keep telling Jeremy, regardless of what we do, let’s make more friends, help our volunteers to get along, make friends and develop relationships, because in 5 to 10 years, the work is going to evolve, right? How VGC looks will be different. But it’s really the people that we’ve met along the way and how we have made friends, and that’s going to last us a long way. And that’s also what is going to make the group strong in 5, 10 years, 20 years. If I could go back in time, probably I’ll spend a bit more time on getting to know each other better, getting to know our new volunteers and making friends.
Jeremy Kosman [27:50]: Yeah, just about to say the same thing as well. The people that I’ve met along the way in VGC make it meaningful. And that’s why I want to step up also because VGC has enriched my life in many ways. Apart from the joy that I get when I make others happy through music, it’s also the friends that I make. And the people that we meet here in volunteering is almost as real as you can get. Because it’s the shared purpose of doing good, that brings us together and like drops all the agendas you know that some of you sometimes have with people in your workplace. You might have different agendas. But in volunteering, everyone’s here to do good and I guess that’s where you can make the best friends.
Grace Ann Chua [28:30]: What would be one piece of practical advice that you would like to give our listeners today, who are thinking about leadership succession, something that you can apply first thing tomorrow morning?
Yi Qi Ng [28:28]: I suppose its something that I talked about just now, which was really think about the conditions that will enable our volunteers or everyone to take up leadership roles, regardless of whether they are actually in a leadership position. So, take care of the people and I think the rest will take care of themselves.
Jeremy Kosman [28:57]: I was about to say also, you can start delegating work, like choose maybe one piece of the project that is maybe safe to fail and give it to someone, maybe a volunteer, for him or her to help out and see how it goes. Then that’s how you build leaders. Another piece I can share is probably you can start like guidebooks. So, if you haven’t had any documentation of your process, maybe it’s a good time to do so. You can do an exercise called Value Stream Mapping– something that I learned recently, something that will help make your process more efficient to eliminate waste in the process to make things more efficient.
Grace Ann Chua [29:40]: Great advice! Thanks so much, Jeremy and Yi Qi for joining us on this episode!
Jeremy Kosman [29:45]: Thank you for having us.
Yi Qi Ng [29:46]: Thanks for having us.
Grace Ann Chua [29:49]: And we’re done. That’s the end of our leadership succession segment. Next episode, we’re moving along the community journey to talk about what happens when someone decides to move on, see you then!
